next message in archive
next message in thread
previous message in archive
previous message in thread
Index of Subjects
97d"><u></u>
--_78ec8002-a25e-4f9d-952c-d3bf99dd43a4_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Andrew=2C
=20
The quote comes from an author (a junior author=2C I stand corrected David)=
not by me. I included it because a comment was made in an earlier email ab=
out fungicide effects versus pesticide targets. The author is expressing th=
e opinion that=2C at least in the USA=2C the effects of fungicides on non-t=
arget organisms and processes in the environment are not fully appreciated.=
Your comments seem to support his general position concerning the fact tha=
t there are unanticipated environmental effects.=20
=20
Coming back to Blake's original observation of a lack of insects=2C a measu=
re of insect abundance has existed since the internal combustion engine beg=
an powering wheels. The simple car windshield transect survey. Most people =
reading this have undoubtedly observed a many-fold reduction in the number =
of insects that get smeared on their windshield driving a familiar stretch =
of road in the summer then there would have been even ten years ago. I had =
zero tonight on a 70km suppertime drive=2C half of which is through agricul=
tural land. Conditions were clear and about 24C.
=20
All the best=2C
=20
Lance
=20
From: HEBDAAJ@gov.ns.ca
To: naturens@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject: RE: [NatureNS] comment re Empty Forests
Date: Wed=2C 14 Aug 2013 17:58:35 +0000
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Hi Lance=0A=
=0A=
Not having had a chance to read it through=2C but I did my masters on Ecolo=
gical impacts of broad-scale pesticides (back before the days the field was=
named ecotoxicology)=0A=
and find the statement you quote as a bit odd.=0A=
=0A=
Just because it is a fungicide and is registered for that use does not mean=
it will not impact other elements within ecosystems.=0A=
=0A=
For purposes of registering a chemical for a specific use=2C there was a re=
quirement for extensive efficacy testing as well as a standard suite of tox=
icological=0A=
testing (usually involving species such as a salmonid=2C Japanese quail=
=2C Daphnia spp etc=85 ) These data would be used to determine LD50s and 9=
6hrs LC 50 etc =96 the basic toxicological data to ensure they did not cau=
se excessive impacts on non-target elements. =0A=
So each formulation of a fungicide and herbicide (as well as insecticide) =
undergoes this form of evaluation. If these toxicological effects are with=
in acceptable ranges=2C then the compounds usually are processed for regist=
ration for use. (this is aside from=0A=
the mutagenic and teratogenic evaluations)=0A=
=0A=
There was=2C and to the best of my knowledge=2C no evaluation of the resul=
ting 1st or second order degradation products in an environmental matrix.=
=0A=
=0A=
So just because it is formulated for one purpose does not mean it does not =
have an effect on other ecological components=2C but with that proper (val=
idated)=0A=
toxicological assessment=2C these effects would be within ranges considere=
d acceptable for that purpose by the Regulators. Keep in mind=2C that this=
applies to the primary active ingredient in a formulated product. In many =
cases=2C the carriers=2C surfactants and=0A=
other fillers are proprietary=2C and are (were) not evaluated. =0A=
=0A=
Getting a complete understanding of all potential effects of introduction o=
f a =93foreign=94 compound into an ecosystem has always been parallel to ta=
king apart=0A=
a large paper-wasp=92s nest=2C 1 square cm at a time=2C while the workers =
were still building it. A slow and painful procedure.=0A=
=0A=
Andrew=0A=
(from my previous research background=2C not my current occupation)=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=
--_78ec8002-a25e-4f9d-952c-d3bf99dd43a4_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<html>
<head>
<style><!--
.hmmessage P
{
margin:0px=3B
padding:0px
}
body.hmmessage
{
font-size: 12pt=3B
font-family:Calibri
}
--></style></head>
<body class=3D'hmmessage'><div dir=3D'ltr'>Hi Andrew=2C<BR> =3B<BR>The =
quote =3Bcomes from =3Ban author (a junior author=2C I stand correc=
ted David) not by me. I =3Bincluded it because a comment was made in an=
earlier email about fungicide effects versus pesticide targets. The author=
is =3Bexpressing the opinion =3Bthat=2C at least in the USA=2C&nbs=
p=3Bthe effects of fungicides on non-target organisms and processes in the =
environment are not fully appreciated. Your comments seem to support his ge=
neral position concerning the fact that there are unanticipated environment=
al effects. <BR> =3B<BR>Coming back to Blake's original observation of =
a lack of insects=2C a measure of insect abundance has existed since the in=
ternal combustion engine began powering wheels. The simple car windshield t=
ransect survey. =3BMost people =3Breading this have undoubtedly&nbs=
p=3Bobserved a many-fold reduction in the number of insects that get smeare=
d on their windshield driving a familiar stretch of road in the summer then=
there would have been even ten years ago. I had zero tonight on a 70km sup=
pertime drive=2C half of which is =3Bthrough agricultural land. Conditi=
ons were clear and about 24C.<BR> =3B<BR>All the best=2C<BR> =3B<BR=
>Lance<br> =3B<BR><div><hr id=3D"stopSpelling">From: HEBDAAJ@gov.ns.ca<=
br>To: naturens@chebucto.ns.ca<br>Subject: RE: [NatureNS] comment re Empty =
Forests<br>Date: Wed=2C 14 Aug 2013 17:58:35 +0000<br><br>=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
<style><!--=0A=
.ExternalClass p.ecxMsoNormal=2C .ExternalClass li.ecxMsoNormal=2C .Externa=
lClass div.ecxMsoNormal {=0A=
font-size:12.0pt=3B=0A=
font-family:"Times New Roman"=2C"serif"=3B=0A=
}=0A=
=0A=
.ExternalClass a:link=2C .ExternalClass span.ecxMsoHyperlink {=0A=
color:blue=3B=0A=
text-decoration:underline=3B=0A=
}=0A=
=0A=
.ExternalClass span.ecxMsoHyperlinkFollowed {=0A=
color:purple=3B=0A=
text-decoration:underline=3B=0A=
}=0A=
=0A=
.ExternalClass p {=0A=
font-size:12.0pt=3B=0A=
font-family:"Times New Roman"=2C"serif"=3B=0A=
}=0A=
=0A=
.ExternalClass p.ecxMsoAcetate=2C .ExternalClass li.ecxMsoAcetate=2C .Exter=
nalClass div.ecxMsoAcetate {=0A=
font-size:8.0pt=3B=0A=
font-family:"Tahoma"=2C"sans-serif"=3B=0A=
}=0A=
=0A=
.ExternalClass p.ecxMsoListParagraph=2C .ExternalClass li.ecxMsoListParagra=
ph=2C .ExternalClass div.ecxMsoListParagraph {=0A=
font-size:12.0pt=3B=0A=
font-family:"Times New Roman"=2C"serif"=3B=0A=
}=0A=
=0A=
.ExternalClass span.ecxBalloonTextChar {=0A=
font-family:"Tahoma"=2C"