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ia ran as follows. What is the difference between a specialist and
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Hi Nick & All,
I agree that managing against the grain ensures problems but=20
sometimes choice is defined in advance. When I toured NE NB in the early=20
50s there were huge tracts of "virgin" Fir in nearly pure stands; a=20
banquet both for Budworm then active and pulp cutters trying to get=20
there first; trees like very long taper candles with no branches and=20
just a tiny flame of green at the top. In that era also much of the=20
virgin and roadless highlands in Cape Breton were largely even sized Fir=20
from horizon to horizon. And no doubt especially vulnerable to Budworm.
When Budworm hit Cape Breton many decades ago the indications, when=20
I saw them while deer hunting in the fall, were that they favored sites=20
where Spruce/Fir began needle growth early in the season; well drained =20
light soil and level or with a southern exposure. In many cases these=20
sites were old abandoned farms with Spruce up to 30" DBH, and every tree=20
was killed, so tree age was not a factor. Trees on north facing slopes=20
or in bogs were spared or the last to go.
But when this was over and the crosspiled dead trees became=20
effective seed traps, the regrowth, depending upon seed/banks/sources=20
was either dense hardwood thickets or Fir so thick that the trees had to=20
be pried apart as one advanced.
I would guess that the major difference between a forest downed by=20
Budworm and a clearcut forest is that the Budworm does it silently.=20
without sawdust and worm frass is largely unsuitable for house timbers,=20
newspapers and various paper tissues.
Yt, DW, Kentville
------ Original Message ------
From: "Nick Hill" <fernhillns@gmail.com>
To: naturens@chebucto.ns.ca
Sent: 1/23/2018 2:20:35 PM
Subject: Re: Spruce Budworm: was Re[2]: [NatureNS] Junco abundance
>Hi David, it wasn't an argument as an observation that the budworm is=20
>part of the ecosystem and the forest community...it is a driver as is=20
>fire. With the increase in young even aged conifer, we expect the=20
>insect to flourish. Not my area but young even aged conifer will have a=20
>different (higher nutrient) nutrient signature from older conifer and=20
>will attract and sustain large budworm populations.
>
>Managing against the grain is difficult. Difficult to keep conifer=20
>conifer and exclude red maple, difficult to maintain even aged conifer=20
>in the landscape without epidemic insect attacks.
>Nick
>
>On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 1:24 PM, David <dwebster@glinx.com> wrote:
>>Hi Paul, Nick & All,
>> In case you don't understand Nick; I am with Paul on this one.
>> The Budworm has been slowly building in Quebec and is sure to=20
>>reach here eventually. When that happens the commercial value of=20
>>standing Spruce and Fir will become negative. I don't have industry=20
>>contacts but suspect that the rumored (and perhaps factual) current=20
>>high rate of clear cutting is partly a reaction to the budworm threat.=20
>>Native or not it is a plague from an economic viewpoint. Yes it renews=20
>>but so does fire and clearcut. And want driven out-migration gives=20
>>woodland to big industry for a song.
>> Back in the early 50s a common joke at Acadia ran as follows. What=
=20
>>is the difference between a specialist and an ecologist ? The=20
>>Specialist knows everything about nothing and the Ecologist knows=20
>>nothing about everything. Some things don't change.
>>Yt, DW. Kentville
>>
>>
>>
>>------ Original Message ------
>>From: "Nick Hill" <fernhillns@gmail.com>
>>To: naturens@chebucto.ns.ca
>>Sent: 1/23/2018 11:52:52 AM
>>Subject: Re: [NatureNS] Junco abundance
>>
>>>First principle:
>>>Spruce Budworm is a native species and part of an ecological complex=20
>>>that until recently did not involve Homo sapiens.
>>>
>>>
>>>On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 11:18 AM,=20
>>>rita.paul@ns.sympatico.ca<rita.paul@ns.sympatico.ca> wrote:
>>>>Well Eric and All Sat evening I was watching a program
>>>>on TV The Semaine Verte - I am not perfectly fluent in French
>>>>but I can follow. Its always a good program on farming, forestry, =20
>>>>fishing
>>>>and so on. A common sense program!
>>>>Anyway that one was on the Spruce Budworm in Quebec and how it
>>>>was spreading. No doubt the smaller birds had lots to eat in those=20
>>>>areas
>>>>where the budworm was common. When winter descended they would have
>>>>took off in masse and some found us in Nova Scotia.
>>>>The Budworm is a plague we could do without.
>>>>Enjoy the rain
>>>>Paul
>>>>>On January 20, 2018 at 5:12 PM Eric Mills <E.Mills@Dal.Ca> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>Today, January 20, my son Chris and I drove from Brier Island to=20
>>>>>the Bridgewater area and to my home in Lower Rose Bay, Lunenburg=20
>>>>>Co., Our route was along Hwy 217 on Long Island and Digby Neck,=20
>>>>>along 101 to the Bear River turnoff, then across country via Bear=20
>>>>>River and the Virginia East Road to Hwy 8, thence south to South=20
>>>>>Brookfield and Hwy 208, then W to Hwy 325 and south to Bridgewater=20
>>>>>and beyond - very roughly 220 km in total.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>There were Juncos along the whole route, going up from the=20
>>>>>roadsides in groups of 2-3 to more than 100 at a time. Our total=20
>>>>>was many hundreds, and likely in the thousands. I have seen numbers=20
>>>>>like these along that route in October, but January is most=20
>>>>>unusual.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Circumstantial evidence for sure, but I have no doubt that these=20
>>>>>birds are new arrivals in the province, probably related to stormy=20
>>>>>weather during the past few days in New Brunswick. Our feeders in=20
>>>>>Lower Rose Bay seemed to attract high numbers starting about the=20
>>>>>16th or 17th, coinciding with the last snowfalls.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Eric L. Mills
>>>>>
>>>>>Lower Rose Bay
>>>>>
>>>>>Lunenburg Co., NS
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>--
>>>Dr. N.M.Hill
>>>Fern Hill Institute of Plant Conservation
>>>424 Bentley Road, Berwick, NS, B0P 1E0=20
>>><https://maps.google.com/?q=3D424+Bentley+Road,+Berwick,+NS,+B0P+1E0&ent=
ry=3Dgmail&source=3Dg>
>>>
>>>phone 902-698-0416 <tel:(902)%20698-0416>
>
>
>
>--
>Dr. N.M.Hill
>Fern Hill Institute of Plant Conservation
>424 Bentley Road, Berwick, NS, B0P 1E0
>
>phone 902-698-0416
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<html><head><style id=3D"css_styles" type=3D"text/css"><!--blockquote.cite=
{ margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px; padding-left: 10px; padding-right:0p=
x; border-left: 1px solid #cccccc }
blockquote.cite2 {margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px; padding-left: 10px;=
padding-right:0px; border-left: 1px solid #cccccc; margin-top: 3px; padding=
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a img { border: 0px; }
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-style-position: inside;}
body { font-family: Tahoma; font-size: 12pt; }--></style></head><body><di=
v>Hi Nick & All,</div><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 I agree that managing against=
the grain ensures problems but sometimes choice is defined in advance. When =
I toured NE NB in the early 50s there were huge tracts of "virgin" Fir in=
nearly pure stands; a banquet both for Budworm then active and pulp cutters =
trying to get there first; trees like very long taper candles with no bran=
ches and just a tiny flame of green at the top. In that era also much of th=
e virgin and roadless highlands in Cape Breton were largely even sized Fir=
from horizon to horizon. And no doubt especially vulnerable to Budworm.</di=
v><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 When Budworm hit Cape Breton many decades ago the indi=
cations, when I saw them while deer hunting in the fall, were that they fav=
ored sites where Spruce/Fir began needle growth early in the season; well d=
rained =C2=A0light soil and level or with a southern exposure. In many case=
s these sites were old abandoned farms with Spruce up to 30" DBH, and every =
tree was killed, so tree age was not a factor. Trees on north facing slope=
s or in bogs were spared or the last to go.=C2=A0</div><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 B=
ut when this was over and the crosspiled dead trees became effective seed t=
raps, the regrowth, depending upon seed/banks/sources was either dense hard=
wood thickets or Fir so thick that the trees had to be pried apart as one a=
dvanced.</div><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 I would guess that the major difference be=
tween a forest downed by Budworm and a clearcut forest is that the Budworm=
does it silently. without sawdust and worm frass is largely unsuitable for=
house timbers, newspapers and various paper tissues.=C2=A0</div><div>Yt, DW=
, Kentville</div><div><br /></div>
<div><br /></div>
<div>------ Original Message ------</div>
<div>From: "Nick Hill" <<a href=3D"mailto:fernhillns@gmail.com">fernhill=
ns@gmail.com</a>></div>
<div>To: <a href=3D"mailto:naturens@chebucto.ns.ca">naturens@chebucto.ns.ca=
</a></div>
<div>Sent: 1/23/2018 2:20:35 PM</div>
<div>Subject: Re: Spruce Budworm: was Re[2]: [NatureNS] Junco abundance</di=
v><div><br /></div>
<div id=3D"x11b0829232ee4e0"><blockquote cite=3D"CAOK1_GYWDEC3VytSiyL8X91dW=
5xb61-VnM+Bphmyge4rfO+xiQ@mail.gmail.com" type=3D"cite" class=3D"cite2">
<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"">Hi David, it wasn'=
t an argument as an observation that the budworm is part of the ecosystem a=
nd the forest community...it is a driver as is fire. With the increase in y=
oung even aged conifer, we expect the insect to flourish. Not my area but y=
oung even aged conifer will have a different (higher nutrient) nutrient sig=
nature from older conifer and will attract and sustain large budworm popula=
tions.=C2=A0</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D""><br /></div><div=
class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"">Managing against the grain is difficult. =
Difficult to keep conifer conifer and exclude red maple, difficult to main=
tain even aged conifer in the landscape without epidemic insect attacks.</d=
iv><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"">Nick</div></div><div class=3D"gm=
ail_extra"><br /><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 1:24 PM=
, David <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:dwebster@glinx.com">dwebste=
r@glinx.com</a>></span> wrote:<br /><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" st=
yle=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div>=
<div>Hi Paul, Nick & All,</div><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 In case you don't und=
erstand Nick; I am with Paul on this one.=C2=A0</div><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 The =
Budworm has been slowly building in Quebec and is sure to reach here event=
ually. When that happens the commercial value of standing Spruce and Fir wi=
ll become negative. I don't have industry contacts but suspect that the rum=
ored (and perhaps factual) current high rate of clear cutting is partly a r=
eaction to the budworm threat. Native or not it is a plague from an economi=
c viewpoint. Yes it renews but so does fire and clearcut. And want driven o=
ut-migration gives woodland to big industry for a song.</div><div>=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 Back in the early 50s a common joke at Acadia ran as follows. What is=
the difference between a specialist and an ecologist ? The Specialist knows =
everything about nothing and the Ecologist knows nothing about everything. =
Some things don't change.</div><div>Yt, DW. Kentville</div><div><br /></di=
v><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0</div>
<div><br /></div>
<div>------ Original Message ------</div>
<div>From: "Nick Hill" <<a href=3D"mailto:fernhillns@gmail.com">fernhill=
ns@gmail.com</a>></div>
<div>To: <a href=3D"mailto:naturens@chebucto.ns.ca">naturens@chebucto.ns.ca=
</a></div>
<div>Sent: 1/23/2018 11:52:52 AM</div>
<div>Subject: Re: [NatureNS] Junco abundance</div><div><br /></div>
<div id=3D"m_-71025721369469546xba86506362de424"><blockquote cite=3D"http:/=
/CAOK1_GZULozS2pUiY53Ex2bNtYo_6ewEeHZTZnCscpzVEG1quw@mail.gmail.com" type=
=3D"cite" class=3D"m_-71025721369469546cite2">
<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_default">First principle:</div><div cl=
ass=3D"gmail_default">Spruce Budworm is a native species and part of an eco=
logical complex that until recently did not involve Homo sapiens.=C2=A0</di=
v><div class=3D"gmail_default"><br /></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"=
><br /><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 11:18 AM, <a href=
=3D"mailto:rita.paul@ns.sympatico.ca">rita.paul@ns.sympatico.ca</a> <span d=
ir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:rita.paul@ns.sympatico.ca">rita.paul@ns.sy=
mpatico.ca</a>></span> wrote:<br /><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" sty=
le=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><u></u=
>
=20
=20
=20
=20
<div>
=20
<div>
Well Eric and All Sat evening I was watching a program
</div>=20
<div>
on TV The Semaine Verte - I am not perfectly fluent in French<br />
</div>=20
<div>
but I can follow. Its always a good program on farming, forestry,=C2=A0=
fishing<br />
</div>=20
<div>
and so on. A common sense program!<br />
</div>=20
<div>
Anyway that one was on the Spruce Budworm in Quebec and how it<br />
</div>=20
<div>
was spreading. No doubt the smaller birds had lots to eat in those areas=
<br />
</div>=20
<div>
where the budworm was common. When winter descended they would have<br /=
>
</div>=20
<div>
took off in masse and some found us in Nova Scotia.<br />
</div>=20
<div>
The Budworm is a plague we could do without.<br />
</div>=20
<div>
Enjoy the rain<br />
</div>=20
<div>
Paul<br />
</div>=20
<blockquote style=3D"padding-left:10px;margin-left:0px;border-left-color:=
blue;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid" type=3D"cite" class=3D"=
m_-71025721369469546cite">
On January 20, 2018 at 5:12 PM Eric Mills <<a href=3D"mailto:E.Mills@=
Dal.Ca">E.Mills@Dal.Ca</a>> wrote:
<br />
<br />=20
<div id=3D"m_-71025721369469546m_256023752921093042divtagdefaultwrapper" =
style=3D"color:#000000;font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:=
12pt" dir=3D"ltr">=20
<p style=3D"margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">Today, January 20, my son =
Chris and I drove from Brier Island to the Bridgewater area and to my home =
in Lower Rose Bay, Lunenburg Co., Our route was along Hwy 217 on Long Isla=
nd and Digby Neck, along 101 to the Bear River turnoff, then across country =
via Bear River and the Virginia East Road to Hwy 8, thence south to South=
Brookfield and Hwy 208, then W to Hwy 325 and south to Bridgewater and beyo=
nd - very roughly 220 km in total.</p>=20
<p style=3D"margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">=C2=A0</p>=20
<p style=3D"margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">There were Juncos along t=
he whole route, going up from the roadsides in groups of 2-3 to more than 1=
00 at a time. Our total was many hundreds, and likely in the thousands. I h=
ave seen numbers like these along that route in October, but January is mos=
t unusual.</p>=20
<p style=3D"margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">=C2=A0</p>=20
<p style=3D"margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">Circumstantial evidence f=
or sure, but I have no doubt that these birds are new arrivals in the provi=
nce, probably related to stormy weather during the past few days in New Bru=
nswick. Our feeders in Lower Rose Bay seemed to attract high numbers starti=
ng about the 16th or 17th, coinciding with the last snowfalls.</p>=20
<p style=3D"margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">=C2=A0</p>=20
<p style=3D"margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">Eric L. Mills</p>=20
<p style=3D"margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">Lower Rose Bay</p>=20
<p style=3D"margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">Lunenburg Co., NS</p>=20
<p style=3D"margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">=C2=A0</p>=20
</div>=20
</blockquote>=20
<div>
<br />=C2=A0
</div>
=20
</div>
</blockquote></div><br /><br clear=3D"all" /><span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font c=
olor=3D"#888888"><div><br /></div>-- <br /><div class=3D"m_-710257213694695=
46gmail_signature" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature">Dr. N.M.Hill<br />Fer=
n Hill Institute of Plant Conservation<br /><a href=3D"https://maps.google.=
com/?q=3D424+Bentley+Road,+Berwick,+NS,+B0P+1E0&entry=3Dgmail&sourc=
e=3Dg">424 Bentley Road, Berwick, NS, B0P 1E0</a><br /><br />phone <a href=
=3D"tel:(902)%20698-0416" value=3D"+19026980416">902-698-0416</a></div>
</font></span></div>
</blockquote></div>
</div></blockquote></div><br /><br clear=3D"all" /><div><br /></div>-- <br=
/><div class=3D"gmail_signature" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature">Dr. N.M=
.Hill<br />Fern Hill Institute of Plant Conservation<br />424 Bentley Road, =
Berwick, NS, B0P 1E0<br /><br />phone 902-698-0416</div>
</div>
</blockquote></div>
</body></html>
--------=_MBB7400488-3B12-4EC7-8A64-FFA8EE37C565--
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